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ptrsnake13

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#41 [url]

Apr 3 12 6:16 PM

MMT is a Methadone Maintainance Treatment and all programs have liquid. The pills you're referring to come from Pain Clinics where patients are prescribed them for various ailments such as back pain,, knee relacement, anything where a strong pain killer is needed. A 30 mg amount without water added to it can take up 1/2 inch or less of the bottle.

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katyrae2

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#42 [url]

Apr 3 12 6:27 PM

      yes a common side effect of too much of an opioid is nausea and vomiting. I know it's hard for you at this point to not be angry at the world, but methadone didn't choose to kill him, ya know? The fact of the STUPID friend who gave it to him and the fact of not knowing anything about it is what killed him. I would look at this differently if the friend said "hey heres 15mg, you don't want to take this with anything else and it will help the pain." but no he just handed him these bottles thinking it was OK. methadone is very safe when used properly, therapeutically, when abused though it is NOT forgiving.
Narcan isn't always the answer either though to a methadone overdose, this could have still happened if he was given narcan. Due to methadone's long half life he could have been given a shot of narcan 10 hours after ingesting the methadone, and died after being released from the hospital due to methadone peaking in the system again and the narcan wearing off.

-whiterobot122

Oh I understand that it didnt choose to kill him, when I say dangerous drug I mean its dangerous for someone who its not prescribed for or someone who knows nothing about what it is, I understand it can be a life saver for many. Since my son has died Ive read many accounts where a primary dr prescribed a nontolerant opiate person methadone for pain management and even in very small doses like 15mgs - 20mgs they have died in their sleep the first day theyve taken it, but for those in the clinic who are taking it its safe for them. It also says under an overdose of methadone the hospital drs should have given him narcan every 4-5 hrs throughout a 36hr period atleast.....my son fell asleep for several hours throughout Sunday afternoon and evening how come he didnt die then but it took until later the next morning? 

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katyrae2

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#43 [url]

Apr 3 12 6:40 PM

    Katy, I'm so sorry for your loss.
This was not your fault, you did nothing wrong. The hospital are at fault for not keeping him on the hospital and monitoring his vital signs.
Are the detectives looking into who gave your son the methadone?

-sapphire76

Thank you so much, its hard not to blame myself even though I did believe i was saving my sons life by taking him to the hospital but I guess I could have kept him home and did nothing and he still would have died, no one at the hospital, not a PA, not a nurse, not a dr ever mentioned pumping his stomach or giving him narcan, thats what the detectives are looking into, they havent really mentioned much about where he got it from but i am sure once it comes back showing in his system then they will look further into it, and I hope and pray that everyone involved from beginning to end is held accountable...

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katyrae2

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#44 [url]

Apr 3 12 6:46 PM

    MMT is a Methadone Maintainance Treatment and all programs have liquid. The pills you're referring to come from Pain Clinics where patients are prescribed them for various ailments such as back pain,, knee relacement, anything where a strong pain killer is needed. A 30 mg amount without water added to it can take up 1/2 inch or less of the bottle.

-ptrsnake13

oh ok that makes sense, see he kept saying it wasnt that much in the bottle, that it wasnt the full 30mgs, he just didnt realise, it breaks my heart.  Thanks for clearing that up for me.

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katyrae2

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#45 [url]

Apr 3 12 6:52 PM

    If you're talking about Katy's loss, I don't understand someone giving away 2 bottles of 30, and then one for 100. There has to be more to the story that this poor woman isn't aware of because being on a program, most people know how much a vigin should take. All in all it's just a damn shame for her.

-ptrsnake13

This medication wasnt the kids, I honestly dont know where he got it from but once we locate him or the detectives do then we'll know the answers to these questions, I dont know if he knew anything about what he was handing out or not but I was told he also took it but I dont know if anything happened to him too.  I believe this kid either got into someone elses medicine or he bought it but I dont believe it belong to him.

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katyrae2

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#46 [url]

Apr 3 12 7:22 PM

    I don't understand. if you don't think the methadone belonged to that kid it sounds like you may know him or something about him. If so, why not go straight to him and find out where it came from. In some states you can be held manslaughter or worse for giving someone a deadly dose of narcotics. Try to find out who's it was exactly and/or the program it came from. It sounds to me, and this is just my opinion, that you may have a lot of options in getting to the bottom of this. Just knowing the house he was in is a huge start to get some answers. If the police don't help then get a P.I. I bet he can find out all you need to know in 2 or 3 days. Sneaking pills is one thing but having liquid methadone means it came from a program. They're the only places with liquid. I'm sure these kids, especially if they're on drugs, would start flapping their gums very quickly with a minimum amount of pressure. I would let nothing stop me until I got satisfactory answers. Good luck and again, my condolences.
Pete

-ptrsnake13

I agree with you on that some of those kids that showed up that night probably do drugs and will start talking, id ask my son but he isnt here any more, sadly, when I say I dont believe the methadone belonged to him is because of the things my son told me before he died, when I asked him what was wrong with him and he told me what he had taken I freaked out and started grilling him, asking him why in Gods name would he take something from someone when he didnt even know what it was or knew anything about this  person, he said the kid told him if it worked for him he could get more of it, and after my son died talk around the neighborhood about this kid just gave me the idea that it wasnt his, or that he doesnt go to a clinic for it but rather he buys it from others or he steals it from someone, that hes just a little punk but we cant really do anything until we get the reports back and the detectives seem mostly interested in why the hospital drs failed to treat my son properly..i will do whatever i humanly can to see that everyone from beginning to end is held accountable for my son dying, he didnt have to die that day.......he shouldnt have and thank you for your kindness its been extremely hard on me and his family.

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ccourtneymac

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#47 [url]

Apr 4 12 2:32 AM




 I had spoke with  someone whose an older gentlemen and he told me a little information about methadone, this gentlemen well hes a neighborhood friend knows my sons he stopped by to give his condolences and we started talking about it, i told him what had happened and what my son had said and he mentioned to me that 30mgs wouldnt be that much actually and it wouldnt fill a whole bottle like my son thought it would,

-katyrae2

Well, that makes sense, an older gentlemen that lives in the neighborhood with MMT experience dropped by to give his condolences and was able to educate you.  That is a happy coincidence, meaning he just happened to know something about MMT, and you were wanting to know something about MMT.




 I feel guilty because I didnt get up during the night an check on my son 

-katyrae2

I came home after being out with friends , went to his room to say goodnight and noticed his face was pale white, his muscle looked very laxed and he was scratching himself like crazy, I asked what the heck was wrong with him and he told me, I got on the internet and googled it, read that 30mg could kill a nontolerant person so I told him, why in gods name would u do something like that, he got scared called the paramedics, they came, [ENDQUOTE]

Why would you feel guilty about not getting up in the night to check on him?  I thought you came home and found him?  Pardon my question, I am not the sharpest tool in the shed fer sure, but I am more confused than ever!  

Another question is if this drug dealing phantom (no one knows his name/who he is/where he came from) had OxyContin (which is a pain killer) he was passing out to the other kids, why not give your son an OxyContin? 

 Usually drug dealers expect money for their trouble.  It is hard to see it any other way, but in the scenario you have given it makes sense to me that the dope dealer was called over there to sell drugs.  Often kids that have to do so many OCs to "get off" graduate to other things out of financial necessity, specifically heroin and/or methadone.  Is it possible that your son was a drug user/abuser?  He might have been taking methadone in dibs and dabs here and there, but when he hurt his ankle he made the fatal decision to up the dose.  

Anyhoo, just stuff to consider, but I am mighty glad the police are working on this case and they punch the ticket on whoever sold (gave) that methadone to your son.

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whiterobot122

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#48 [url]

Apr 4 12 6:19 AM

Yea 30mg is going to be about 1/2 to 1cm up the bottle, very small amount. Also, one thing that isn't as common, but does happen is that compounding pharmacies can fill a prescription for methadone oral concentrate (syrup), so in your mind you think "Oh it's methadone liquid, it's gotta be from a clinic" and most the time it is from a clinic if you find syrup, but just remember a pain patient CAN get their hands legally on methadone syrup, I doubt it is as common, but it can occur.

I hope you just keep up this drive to find the person who gave it to him and to educate as many people around you as you can. Abusing methadone is not forgiving and I always tell that to people who do abuse it.

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ccourtneymac

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#49 [url]

Apr 4 12 10:09 PM

but just remember a pain patient CAN get their hands legally on methadone syrup, 

-whiterobot122

This is true.  People on Medicare can get liquid in 1,000 ml bottles.  I am not sure about people on Medicaid.

@Katy I apologize, after reading my post someone pointed out that you might have meant you wished that you had checked on him AFTER you got him home from the hospital, not before he went to the hospital.  

Please do not take responsibility for this tragedy.  This could have happened to any mother any time.  Our children go out in the world and we pray that they make the best decisions.  How can we deny them freedom?  We can't keep them chained in their bedrooms!

So, God bless and hang in there.

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katyrae2

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#50 [url]

Apr 5 12 3:36 AM

   

Well, that makes sense, an older gentlemen that lives in the neighborhood with MMT experience dropped by to give his condolences and was able to educate you.  That is a happy coincidence, meaning he just happened to know something about MMT, and you were wanting to know something about MMT.



-ccourtneymac

  Pardon me if Im taking this wrong but Im getting the impression you dont believe me or that Im lying about this? Not that I should have to defend myself because frankly I dont care what you or anyone else thinks, all I really care about is that my son is DEAD because he overdosed on medication that someone with no morals or scruppels gave him and the ER dept I took my son to did NOTHING to help save his life for whatever reasons, perhaps they got the wrong idea and theyve seen that so much they dont care anymore but  Like I said forgive me if Im wrong but its how Im feeling so let me set it straight, when I say older gentleman I mean someone whose older than my son, hes in his middle 30s and he stopped by because he knows both of my sons, we've lived in this neighborhood for over 21yrs, and wanted to say tell me as my sons mother he was very sorry for his death and if there was anything he could do for me or the family to please let him know, he asked what happen as a rumor had begun to spread that my son overdosed trying to kill himself, so he asked me and I told him what my son and others who were there that night told me, my neighborhood is called the "hood" by some and theres a lot of druggies who live around here, they use or sell so its not a happy coincidence he knew something about methadone, I never said anything about MMT, I have the slightest idea what thats all about and dont care really, he was telling me the same thing happened to his cousin and we were talking about that, he mentioned his doctor "once" prescribed methadone pills in 5mgs to him for a crushed disc in his back, he is on pain management for the crushed disc, he explained to me how he was instructed to take it, he was just telling me what he knew nothing more nothing less....I dont use drugs, never have but i dont judge any one who has everyone has their demons but please dont try and make this into something you think or feel it is because I can assure you, your wrong. My 21yr old son is gone but those responsible for it will pay. 

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katyrae2

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#51 [url]

Apr 5 12 3:52 AM

    Yea 30mg is going to be about 1/2 to 1cm up the bottle, very small amount. Also, one thing that isn't as common, but does happen is that compounding pharmacies can fill a prescription for methadone oral concentrate (syrup), so in your mind you think "Oh it's methadone liquid, it's gotta be from a clinic" and most the time it is from a clinic if you find syrup, but just remember a pain patient CAN get their hands legally on methadone syrup, I doubt it is as common, but it can occur.
I hope you just keep up this drive to find the person who gave it to him and to educate as many people around you as you can. Abusing methadone is not forgiving and I always tell that to people who do abuse it.

-whiterobot122

Thank you, I dont know a lot about this stuff mostly from what Ive read online and from being on this forum and no it isnt a forgiving drug when abused, I am upset very much so with the person who gave it to him but Im also very upset with the hospital for not providing the care he needed, to me it felt like they looked at the situation like "oh just another drug addicted kid"  they were smiling whene they first walked into the room, polite and friendly until they asked what I brought him in for then the smiles went right off their faces and their demeanors changed, maybe Im wrong but thats how it seemed to me.  I'll do whatever I can to see that everyones held accountable, Im upset with my son as well, hes always very health minded, worked out, ate healthy, didnt mess with drugs or alcohol, he was into skateboarding and working out with weights and he always paid attention to what he put into his body, always looking it up so for him to take something without asking about it or questioning it just frustrates me even more.  My son was a good kid and it hurts deeply that hes not here anymore, most of his friends are good kids as well but he always thought he could save everyone who had troubles.....

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katyrae2

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#52 [url]

Apr 5 12 3:58 AM

   
  Pardon me if Im taking this wrong but Im getting the impression you dont believe me or that Im lying about this? Not that I should have to defend myself because frankly I dont care what you or anyone else thinks, all I really care about is that my son is DEAD because he overdosed on medication that someone with no morals or scruppels gave him and the ER dept I took my son to did NOTHING to help save his life for whatever reasons, perhaps they got the wrong idea and theyve seen that so much they dont care anymore but  Like I said forgive me if Im wrong but its how Im feeling so let me set it straight, when I say older gentleman I mean someone whose older than my son, hes in his middle 30s and he stopped by because he knows both of my sons, we've lived in this neighborhood for over 21yrs, and wanted to say tell me as my sons mother he was very sorry for his death and if there was anything he could do for me or the family to please let him know, he asked what happen as a rumor had begun to spread that my son overdosed trying to kill himself, so he asked me and I told him what my son and others who were there that night told me, my neighborhood is called the "hood" by some and theres a lot of druggies who live around here, they use or sell so its not a happy coincidence he knew something about methadone, I never said anything about MMT, I have the slightest idea what thats all about and dont care really, he was telling me the same thing happened to his cousin and we were talking about that, he mentioned his doctor "once" prescribed methadone pills in 5mgs to him for a crushed disc in his back, he is on pain management for the crushed disc, he explained to me how he was instructed to take it, he was just telling me what he knew nothing more nothing less....I dont use drugs, never have but i dont judge any one who has everyone has their demons but please dont try and make this into something you think or feel it is because I can assure you, your wrong.  My 21yr old son is gone but those responsible for it will pay.  

-katyrae2

If I mistook your posts wrong I do apologise, Im just about numb by now over this, not sure what to think or what to go by, just know i took my son to the ER, thinking they were gonna help him, took him home believing he would be ok and went to wake him up and hes cold, stiff, bleeding from his nose, and mouth and hes gone, at 21 yrs old... my life will never be the same again...

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katyrae2

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#53 [url]

Apr 5 12 4:19 AM

   

Well, that makes sense, an older gentlemen that lives in the neighborhood with MMT experience dropped by to give his condolences and was able to educate you.  That is a happy coincidence, meaning he just happened to know something about MMT, and you were wanting to know something about MMT.



-ccourtneymac

  again if I mistook you post above as being acusatory I apologise, I havent been to sleep all  night and its now 5am Thursday ,, I guess atm Im just more angery at the ER drs for not doing their job, I know if the person hadnt given my son the methadone he never would have gone to the ER in tthe first place but you put your trust in doctors and wiith your most prize possession your child, you expect them to dod their very best...its just a complete shock to me so please forgive me iff I was wrong... when I said I felt guilty i meant after I brought him back home from the hospital that morning on Sunday, I checked on him a few times that day after I ran some errands with my daughter and then that night before I went to bed but I never went in during the night time like I usually did, Im not a good sleeper, always checked on my kids during the night when I awoke, but that night I had been so tired from no sleep the night before, being at the ER I slept harder than Ive ever had, if Id gotten up and checked on him I might have been able to save him then, so I feel so guilty, feel as tho I let him down when he needed me the most.  My son didnt abuse drugs, he hated the fact his younger brother had smoked pot before, my son was really into health, wouldnt eat candy or fast foods, drink soda pop, he ate very healthy and worked out, he rode the skateboard so he wanted to be fit to do master his tricks, looking for a sponsor for it, this kid isnt really a phantom, they know his name, probably where to ffind him, hes just a kid who hangs out where ever, my son he just showed up with someone who was  friends with the kid who lived there, when my son was telling his onee friend he was gonna leave and go lay down cuz his ankle hurt he said that other kid who hed seen before in the neighborhood walked over to them and started up a conversation with him, said I have pain medication if you wanna try it, he said he told him it was like demerol or percocets, so my son ok and when he handed him the two bottles because there was hardly in it and because he did give him two to take he thought it  wasnt all of it, said it was just a little amount but when he looked at the label it said 30mgs, I asked him if it had anything else on the label he said he didnt remember, had a number and said keep out of reach children, but by his time he was so out of it he couldt focus , had asked him right when I got home that night he might have been able to give me more information but I was so freakd out about what he did , i didnt think to ask. I just miss my son horribley and I wish this never had happen, Im angry at the kid who gave this to him but for al I know he could be dead too, my son said he swallowed what was left in the 100mg bottle so who knows..I just think kids should be made aware of the dangers of taking someone else meds, and taking meds they arent educated on... any ways Im so sorry if I mistook your quote I wasnt trying to be nasty just upset me a little ......

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mike75

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#54 [url]

Apr 5 12 5:58 AM

Just from that being a liquid and not a pill i'm surprised he even took it to be honest.You never know with liquids what might be mixed in it or tampered with.Your son you described sounds like a healthy,smart kid who stayed out of trouble.The boy who gave it to him was not educated well on the dangers of methadone but the ER and hospital WERE educated on these matters and should've kept your son there at least a couple days until the methadone wore off and was no longer a threat or dangerous.If he took 80 or more mg's of methadone then the hospital should've known that since the boy was not opiate tolerant that the methadone was lethal in your sons body in high amounts and they should've known he was in bad danger and they should've kept a close eye on him and did the proper procedures to keep him alive and watch him until the effects of the medicine were no longer a threat.That hospital should be sued at once for their carelessness and ignorance in the entire matter.I'm sorry katyrae i hope you see to it that those responsible pay for the mistakes that were made.

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whiterobot122

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#55 [url]

Apr 5 12 6:10 AM

@katyrae, courtney's not being rude or anything, it's just the way she types and the way it comes out!

I personally don't know which I'd be more upset at, the kid who gave it to him or the hospital...I honestly think I'd be more mad at the hospital for not doing ANYTHING. You got to experience first hand the prejudice against Methadone and MMT patients....even though your son was not a drug addict in any way, you saw how different they treated you as soon as methadone was brought up...

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whippy witch

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#56 [url]

Apr 5 12 9:09 AM

I have to agree with whiterobot.  This is how someone with an HONEST pain or illness is treated MOST of the time in ER's or even doctor offices.  As soon as you say Methadone you become "Just another addict trying to screw with me to get more drugs".  And MOST of the time the person is telling them about the methadone so they know not to mix other drugs with it or prescribe other medication that could be harmful to the person in combination with their methadone.  It's kinda like now I have to be careful of aspirin because I am on blood thinners and the two together can actually cause internal bleeding.  


Katyrae, you are doing everything you can to deal with this horrible tragedy.  You are hurt, angry and upset, not taking it out on those that aren't to blame, even thinking at times of the whole picture no matter how much it hurts.  Asking questions and educating yourself is a goal that I respect.  Ask away.  

WW

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jaks1

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#57 [url]

Apr 5 12 6:58 PM

this post is referring to a person whose not tolerant on opiates of any kind, if youve been taking methadone already its not gonna do that to you so no need to worry just dont double dose, use common sense when it comes to taking your medication and you will be ok.

-katyrae2


Katy I am so so sorry for your loss. I know how angry you  must be as well as terribly sad and just plain tired. I got this off the internet and had googled in Methadone Intolerant Overdose
here is what it said verbatim:
The Importance of Tolerance
Methadone can be toxic to anyone who is not tolerant of opioids
and a single dose can cause life-threatening respiratory depression
(Harding-Pink 1993b). However, an opioid-tolerant person
can function normally at doses that can be fatal to a non-tolerant
person. Opioid tolerance is a complex process of neuroadaptation
and even experienced opioid users can be at risk of toxic
methadone effects (Strang 1999).
It is essential to estimate an individual’s opioid-dependence,
and associated tolerance, prior to initiating methadone treatment.
Most methadone-associated deaths have been in persons with little
or no tolerance to opioids (Buster and van Brussel 1996).
The traditional definition of tolerance is reduced response to
one or more effects of a drug after repeated administrations
(Kosten and George 2002; O’Brien 1996). Essentially, cells with
opioid receptors become less sensitive to opioid stimulation and
more drug is needed to achieve the same effects.

I am not sure this will do anything for you but i could not find much pertaining to your son's passing but I am really upset with you about the hospital just having him go home when they should have the knowledge of what methadone can do and 80 mg is just way too much for someone who has never taken it. again sorry for your loss. Sincerely Jacki

Don't take life too seriously, you never get out alive.

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bkeithphelps74

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#58 [url]

Apr 5 12 7:05 PM







KatyRae2: Having read almost every post here, I decided to wade into the conversation a little at this point to say this:  While I ABSOLUTELY DO NOT excuse the behavior of the kid that gave your son the medicine, I will say this much: kids do REALLY STUPID things sometimes, that they don't 100% realize just how stupid what they're doing is.  I know I certainly did, and most everyone I knew did - I did things I wish to GOD I could take back or undo now!  And yes, I even supplied drugs to friends when I was addicted, not wanting to hurt them in any way, of course, but occasionally I did it for pain they were having, and occasionally b/c I wanted them to feel good like I was feeling at that moment... whatever.  It was WRONG, and I am SO sorry I ever did that.  Now, for that reason, I would say this: the hospital is whom I would direct the bulk of my anger toward, b/c they KNEW the dangers of methadone, where this other kid likely did not.  They KNEW how to save your son's life, and opted to do nothing.  They KNEW the dangers of synergistic activity between methadone and benzos (lorazepam), and didn't bother to administer either Narcan OR Flumazenil (a benzo antagonist), just to be safe.  In my opinion, they should have done BOTH, since they knew he was on both from your info you gave them.  They KNEW not to release him for more than 24 hours, since even with Narcan, methadone lasts longer than it, so he'd have to be monitored well over a day to be sure the Narcan didn't wear off and the methadone kick back in and cause another OD.  This was the hospital's negligence to release him when they did, and without any further instructions to you (to watch him VERY closely for shallow breathing/etc for the next X # of hours, etc).  Yes, by ALL means, be angry with the kid that supplied it.  He needs to be punished.  But I wouldn't say he needs his entire future ruined because of it - UNLESS he knew the dangers and did it anyway.  If he was simply an ignorant kid that got his hands on it from another ignorant kid or something like that, then punish, yes.  Ruin his life forever, no.  It should be severe enough to shake his entire world, but not ruin him.  Because if he's ANY kind of person, the death of your son will ruin his life enough that he's probably going to have severe problems throughout it anyway... I know I would if I were responsible for someone else's death.  And thank God I didn't cause anything like that - but I realize how easily I could have, and I always cared a lot about my friends.  I just was severely misguided in how I tried to "help" them or show them a fun time.  Even now, (and read this all the way through, everyone, before you get angry...) I have a really difficult time when I have a friend or acquaintance that is sick from withdrawals, because I want to help them at least a little - BUT I DON'T give in to that anymore, for this very reason...  I'm just saying it's very hard on me because I've been there so many times and I know how horrible withdrawals are, and how painful they are for me.  Lastly, I'm very sorry for your loss, and God knows, I wish I could give you back your son.  I am thankful to you, however, that you've not taken this as a reason to rise up against all methadone patients and try to rally to shut down every methadone clinic in your area/state.  You've been very understanding toward those of us in treatment who are helped by our medicine, and many people are not nearly so understanding, even when it wasn't their family affected by tragedy, and even when the medicine was KNOWN to come from a pain patient.  So I thank you VERY much for that, and please know that it is appreciated, I'm sure by more than just me.  And by the way, just FYI for anyone reading this, I have NOT, since getting onto MMT, given away or sold my methadone for the reasons above to others - I was talking about before I got into recovery and was getting street opiates or filling fake prescriptions for other ones (besides methadone.)  Also, the post above was correct - you CAN get liquid methadone at any pharmacy, even if they don't usually stock it (they can all order it - Roxane makes it, and it comes in 2 types - regular potency, which would require much more liquid than would've been in that little bottle you referred to, as it's like 5-10mg per teaspoon, and then the High Potency or "Intensol" brandname from Roxane of the 10mg per 1ml of liquid, which is identical to what we take at the clinic.)  The only difference between ours and the Intensol is that ours is usually cherry flavored at most clinics (though they CAN get unflavored,) and the Intensol is non-flavored, as per the Roxane website (product catalog shows pictures and gives descriptions.)  Incidentally, ALL clinics that use cherry or flavorless liquids use the same strength - 10mg/1ml, which is made by 3 companies at present - Roxane, Mallinckrodt/Covidien, or VistaPharm, all of which have websites that contain the prescribing information leaflet as a .pdf file.  You can get the other strength liquid info at Roxane's website, too.  It's flavored, but not cherry, and it's a different color (ours is usually either red or clear.)  And YES, a bottle with 100mg is quite common from a clinic - which is part of the reason I'd say this: the Intensol comes in 30ml bottles (300mg), so that and the fact that he had 2 bottles that said 30mg and one that said 100mg means it very likely came from a clinic, which is where individual dose bottles would be labeled as such.  A regular pharmacy doesn't package by single doses, but rather gives a dropper syringe for dosing daily out of a bottle of several days' worth.  Although my bigger question about this is: why would the kid have had access to 2 different dose levels (that are that far apart) of daily takehome methadone?  That's VERY odd (not suggesting you're lying, KatyRae2 - just can't figure out how he'd have come up with that, since I'm in a clinic, and I get takehomes, yet I know of nowhere I could come up with 2 different doses that far apart, unless I just went around and asked random people to sell me some and 2 different people did.)  Since I've never purchased illicit methadone since being in a clinic, I don't know any of the sellers personally (though I certainly have known a few who aren't afraid to ask me to sell mine!)  But anyway...  I know this is probably too much information, but I figure you're desperate for as much info as you can get right now, and it takes ages to come up with the stuff we all know on this website, so I thought I'd try to give you some of that to save you the time and effort, just in case.  Again, I give you my sincere condolences, and I wish you the best in your efforts at gaining justice in this, to the extent that it's possible.  God bless you.





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ccourtneymac

Senior Member

Posts: 1,407 Member Since:09/19/11

#59 [url]

Apr 6 12 3:05 AM

@WR, thanks for the support.  You have been posting with me long enough to know...

@Katy, NO OFFENSE INTENDED.  When read a different way that post sounds kinda snide.  I would reword it if I were able.  It can be hard to post online because there is no nuance, no flavor, no facial expressions to tie in and help interpret someone's statements. And please do not take our questions the wrong way - we are curious, but definitely NOT trying to be invasive or hurt you more than you already have been.  I for one, hope that we are able to help you come to terms with this tragedy by listening to your story.  I know sometimes it can help to talk about things and receive the input of others.  

What I fear happened to you at the hospital is not uncommon.  Once the word methadone is mentioned, the game changes, Ms. KatyRae.  The drug in question is hated and despised by almost 100% of health care workers, from doctors to phlebotomists, from radiologists to ultrasound technicians.

At first I was more angry at the kid that walks around with varying amounts of methadone (like @Bkeith, I find this odd-the only thing that makes sense to me is he purchases it from various people on methadone to resell) but now I am beginning to see things in a different light.  I think the hospital staff decided that your baby was some worthless scumbag junkie wasting their time when they could be treating "real" patients. I would sue those son of a bitches, too!

How many of us on this board do not reveal our status so we can avoid the looks of hate, contempt, and disgust from healthcare providers?

For those people that would deny us adequate health care because we take a drug they don't "like" - WE CAN AND DO RECOVER.  But due to their irrational hate of methadone, some never get that chance.  And another child is gone due to the prejudice and hate of methadone.  A child that I believe could have been saved, if the medical staff had not been crippled and blinded by their own prejudices.

This is NOT your fault.  I am sure you did not know about the half-life of methadone.  Plus, you took him to the hospital and trusted that those people knew what they were doing!  You did not know how hated this drug is by medical "professionals."

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mike75

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Posts: 660 Member Since:03/25/12

#60 [url]

Apr 6 12 6:37 AM

@,i think you hit the nail on the head.....they KNEW the dangers of methadone, where this other kid likely did not.  They KNEW how to save your son's life, and opted to do nothing.  They KNEW the dangers of synergistic activity between methadone and benzos (lorazepam), and didn't bother to administer either Narcan OR Flumazenil (a benzo antagonist), just to be safe.  In my opinion, they should have done BOTH, since they knew he was on both from your info you gave them.  They KNEW not to release him for more than 24 hours, since even with Narcan, methadone lasts longer than it, so he'd have to be monitored well over a day to be sure the Narcan didn't wear off and the methadone kick back in and cause another OD.  This was the hospital's negligence to release him when they did, and without any further instructions to you (to watch him VERY closely for shallow breathing/etc for the next X # of hours, etc)

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